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Thread: The chapters of a noob's build

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    The chapters of a noob's build

    Chapter 1: Stock problems and bolt ons

    I just want to say up front, I pretty much entered the car "scene" with an evo. While I have come a long way, I envy a lot of the knowledge everyone has in here. So please bare with my noobness

    Bunch of pics at https://www.instagram.com/mikelbring/

    I bought my evo late January 2015, right before they really announced the final editions. I tried to get a used low mile-age 2014 so I could get recaros but the interest rate was so much better brand new. I thought the car was kinda sluggish and slow (we are gonna get back to this...), but I was just blinded by the evo dream. I didn't know much about performance cars, I did have a genesis coupe before it.

    Fast forward 3 months, I purchased a cobb accessport and a intake, wanting to wake this car up. I put on the stage 1 OTS tune and went for a drive. It was showing only 5psi peak boost, I thought something was wrong with the accessport. I emailed cobb, posted a video online, and kinda came to the conclusion something might be wrong with the car. Took it to the dealership, they said its defiantly not boosting (and we are back to it being sluggish and slow LOL). So turns out, for 3 months, 3000 miles, my car was indeed not boosting brand new from the factory. Got the car back from the dealership, and man was it an awakening. I even put the OTS tune back on right away, felt amazing. Granted I'd never really been in a "fast" car.

    Few months went by, my buddy bought a Focus ST. So we had a friendly little competition. He went basically full bolt ons and put a train on me. I couldn't have it. I did some research and talked to a tuner. Ended up buying a EBCS and a test pipe. Then paying for a cobb pro tune. Really woke the car up, I think it was making low to mid 300s. He couldn't keep up
    Last edited by mikelbring; 08-21-2018 at 08:09 AM.

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    Chapter 2: E85 and blown motor

    I ran FBO for roughly 2 years, loved it. Won a ton of races. But in spring of 2017, I wanted to do more for the following summer season. I wanted to get on corn after reading about the advantages and having it available in my city. I bought a flex fuel kit from WTF, ID1300s and a walbro 450+install kit. I ended up getting the bigger injectors because I knew some day I wanted a bigger turbo and didn't want them to hold me back. I also bought a tactrix and a tephra v3 license because my tuner said we couldn't do flex fuel and sold the cobb.

    We had some issues getting the pump gas tune in and turned out I had a vacuum hose off of my ebcs. That was good, it was time to fill up with e85. I also ended up buying a tial qrj and a new ETS intake. This was mid may and throughout that week, I kept getting fuel cut randomly, I think due to overboost. I sent the logs to the tuner on a Thursday waiting to hear back, but we had a grudge drag race the following Friday and it was the first of the season. I really wanted to go and didn't think much of the issue, that it was just a random thing that needed to be worked out.

    Couple passes in the car kinda felt sluggish. I went back out once more after adjusting my QRJ thinking maybe it was loose. Right at the end of the track, I heard a bunch of popping and then see blue smoke out of the ass end. Sure enough, I fucked up.

    I actually have it on video here: https://www.instagram.com/p/BUm1OH-A...-by=mikelbring

    Some photos are here of the block: https://www.instagram.com/p/BUpDP20g...-by=mikelbring

    What I think ended up happening is, I had some of the vacuum lines on wrong, after installing the QRJ and new intake. I had two of the lines backwards. I think that's what was causing the overboost issue.

    I was pretty defeated. My evo was also my daily driver and I couldn't afford the rebuild all at once. I ended up buying a Fiesta ST (great little car), as a new daily just to have something to drive. So the next 11 months, was me trying to figure out what I wanted to do and buying parts...
    Last edited by mikelbring; 08-21-2018 at 07:14 AM.

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    Chapter 3: Motor build and tuning

    So I went back and forth on what I wanted to do.. and could afford. I was pretty set on getting a stock short block and just upgrading the rods. And then someone local offered me a deal on their built sleeved short block they had as a extra motor. It was sitting in storage and all bagged up. Here's the spec sheet:

    IMG_3678.jpg

    I was a little worried because ERL doesn't exist anymore and it was built in 2015. But after talking to a few people and having it inspected, I made the purchase. If anyone is curious, I paid $4500 for the short block. Which I thought was a good deal. Just a OEM short block + rods/labor would of been close to that.

    Messages Image(4054211821).jpg

    I ordered a bunch more things because I wanted to make the most out of the new motor. Heres a quick parts list:

    - TPC gtx3576r hybrid spec
    - GSC s2 cams, springs, retainers
    - map cast manifold
    - map downpipe
    - MAP baffled oil pan
    - drivenfab catch can
    - MAP valves and gsc valve seals
    - Torque Solutions 4 piece motor mounts and transmission mount

    There was a lot more I had to get obviously that I didn't include just for the motor rebuild. My clutch also still looked good because it was done not to long before my motor blew up (comp stage 3). So I didn't replace that. I took my car and everything to a local shop that mostly specialized in DSMs but gave me a decent quote on getting the new motor in. I didn't have a lot of local options either, so almost had no choice. We had some hiccups but they got it done.

    Pictures of it being assembled:
    IMG_4289.jpg
    IMG_4288.jpg
    IMG_4307.jpg

    One problem is, I ended up moving to Kentucky, my car was in Nebraska. So I had to plan a trip back when they expected it to be done. I booked my ticket for early April 2018. Got there and a few other things still needed to be done. I had to overnight a valve cover gasket. Also I went to load my base tune on the car and my tactrix broke, where the USB port is. Stupid dumb luck. Ended up finding one local but paid out of the ass for it ($180). All in all the car started up great, heres the video: https://www.instagram.com/p/BlbMOEuF...-by=mikelbring

    I had to drive the car from Nebraska back to Kentucky, the next day (800 miles). Had almost no issues after the first start up. We did 2 heat cycles and oil changes just to be safe. Did some vacuum pulls to make sure everything was seated. I drove the car about 100 miles back to where I was staying. I am out of attachments so heres a link to that day parking the car where I was staying: https://www.instagram.com/p/BhX6-VtH...-by=mikelbring

    We had to make a few changes to the base tune because it wasn't really liking to idle, but that wasn't a big deal. I was pretty nervous for my 800+ mile journey the next morning. I drove from Nebraska to Kentucky, mostly staying out of boost, on the base map. Really had no issues, the car never got hot, or acted like it had any issues. It really just needed an alignment.

    Got home and the next day I took it in for an oil change and was ready to start really tuning. Had some initial issues tuning, it just wasn't making the power I thought (my goal was mid 500s). Turns out the 18psi WGA I had just wasn't holding enough boost and I was maxing out the ETS intake. I ordered a drivenfab 3.5" intake (which took 4 weeks no surprise). Once the intake came in, I preloaded the wga almost max to see if it would hold. After retuning with the new intake and the wga changes. It was finally making the power I wanted. Virtual dyno was showing close to 580whp and 450tq. Car has been great for the last few months, had almost no issues. I am running red line 10w-40 in the car.
    Last edited by mikelbring; 08-21-2018 at 08:02 AM.

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    Chapter 4: After build...

    IMG_5599.jpg

    It was a long 11 months from when it blew up in May 2017 to when we had the first start in April 2018. I learned a lot for sure and probably could of saved money in a bunch of places if I had some foresight. But here we are, and I have some ideas for the next step. Even some questions I am eventually going to ask
    Last edited by mikelbring; 08-21-2018 at 08:06 AM.

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    great read and I'm glad it worked out for you!

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    Senior Member mityaz's Avatar
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    Nice man! That was ballsy of you to drive 800mi right after a swap.
    '11 GSR
    current: same exact as last. new block, new head. no kaboom yet.

    2.05L/darton,ProH,CP 10:1 w/Ultimate pins. IWG9174 .92. GSC-S2. 4P head +1mm In/Ex. <--KABOOM (blown HG)

    Past: 2.4L,Manley94,Pro-H,Wiseco,10:1,Darton,4P head,GSC all,Supertec valves,FR 9174 IWG .92,2x450 Walbro/EP control,ID1700,Flex,OSGiken triple. <--KABOOM (spun rod bearing)

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    Quote Originally Posted by mityaz View Post
    Nice man! That was ballsy of you to drive 800mi right after a swap.
    Definitely.. which is why we heat cycled it a few times. We didn't check the clearances of the short block either to make sure everything was good with it. I have a clearance sheet but the block was sitting for over 2 years before it got put in. Everything seems pretty ok now though!

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    I want to try to get a little more out of my turbo. Currently I am running a 18psi WGA and had to preload it almost max to hold enough to redline. 33psi peak taper 26psi to redline. I am looking at upgrading to a 22psi WGA, so I can hold it better to redline and also not have the characteristics of that much preploaded. I am making around 570whp VD and would like to get around 600whp. However I am on id1300. They are currently at 90-93% IDC. My question is, how far do people push these injectors? Should I just upgrade them now? Low 600s will probably be the most I will get out of this turbo and for a long time. So I understand the argument to build for later, but didn't want to spend the money to get 600s if I didn't need to.

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    Senior Member mityaz's Avatar
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    i dont think any tuner will be comfortable with IDC going above that. With that being said, i've personally ran 109% IDC on my ID1700s at 52PSI base pressure. it ran "fine". Not advising you do the same at all, but you know what i mean...
    '11 GSR
    current: same exact as last. new block, new head. no kaboom yet.

    2.05L/darton,ProH,CP 10:1 w/Ultimate pins. IWG9174 .92. GSC-S2. 4P head +1mm In/Ex. <--KABOOM (blown HG)

    Past: 2.4L,Manley94,Pro-H,Wiseco,10:1,Darton,4P head,GSC all,Supertec valves,FR 9174 IWG .92,2x450 Walbro/EP control,ID1700,Flex,OSGiken triple. <--KABOOM (spun rod bearing)

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    Senior Member MetalAF's Avatar
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    Bumping up to ID1700's you might be getting into surge tank /x2 fuel pump/ fuel feed line / rail territory.

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    My tuner already said he didn't want to push them anymore, so probably best to just upgrade injectors.

    As for needing more fueling. Something I have defiantly considered. I think just pushing this turbo to around 600whp will still be ok on my walbro 450, but if I go any further I planned to do a big fuel upgrade. I actually have a OEM fitment radium fuel rail sitting in my closet. I was going to install it when I did the new injectors. I think that might help a little? It would give me the bigger fuel feed.

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    Senior Member MetalAF's Avatar
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    Fuel rail may not help w/o the fuel feed line. I ran my ID1700's without a fuel rail, 8an feed line, pressure regulator and pulse dampener for a little while and the tuner had a really tough time getting it to idle smooth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MetalAF View Post
    Fuel rail may not help w/o the fuel feed line. I ran my ID1700's without a fuel rail, 8an feed line, pressure regulator and pulse dampener for a little while and the tuner had a really tough time getting it to idle smooth.
    Are you saying you ran them on the OEM fuel rail with oem everything else?

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    Senior Member MetalAF's Avatar
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    Yes. Only had swapped in (1) Walbro450 and ID1700's at the time.

    Didn't do the additional Walbro450, fuel rail, feed line, regulator, surge tank and pulse dampener until the turbo upgrade.

    If you swap the fuel rail, you move the choke point down to the feed line. You could always just see how it behaves with just the fuel rail and ID1700's.
    Last edited by MetalAF; 09-13-2018 at 12:41 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MetalAF View Post
    Yes. Only had swapped in (1) Walbro450 and ID1700's at the time.

    Didn't do the additional Walbro450, fuel rail, feed line, regulator, surge tank and pulse dampener until the turbo upgrade.

    If you swap the fuel rail, you move the choke point down to the feed line. You could always just see how it behaves with just the fuel rail and ID1700's.

    I think that's the plan. Are ID1700s good these days? I know they had issues a few years go. I was debating between them, fic1650 or go even bigger to ID2000/fic2150s for if/when I go bigger turbo.

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    Senior Member MetalAF's Avatar
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    Lots of folks on here running the ID1700's

    Here is a note directly from ID's website:
    "The ID1700x will deliver flawless stoichiometric idle and cruise mixtures on E85, but like the ID2000, should not be expected to do so on gasoline.

    If you need flawless drivability on gasoline, the ID1300x will provide this, and is capable of approximately 150hp per injector on E85."


    That being said, 93oct works just fine for me.

    I am happy with them, but get @UT_EvoX , @razorlab or @mityaz to chime in here if you can.
    Last edited by MetalAF; 09-13-2018 at 01:32 PM.

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    from what i heard, that problem was limited to back then and the 1700s are fine. I've been running them with e85 and pump gas for about a year and a half and no problems. I had them flow tested about 6 months ago and no drop off or issues.

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    Senior Member razorlab's Avatar
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    I went from id1300 to id1700 because I maxed my 1300’s

    Don’t expect the id1700’s to be an install and go kind of thing. They need more tables tweaked than the 1300’s, but once you do that they drive just as well as the 1300’s.

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    Thanks for all the info. What kinda power do id1700s typically top out at on E85? Good for close to 700?

    They use the same PnP adapters that I am using for the ID1300s right now right?

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    Senior Member razorlab's Avatar
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    I’m approx 83% IDC on 1700’s at 640whp dynojet at 8600rpm

    However my 450 is maxed as it starts to lean out 7,800rpm plus

    Oem fuel rail, feed and return lines

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    Quote Originally Posted by razorlab View Post
    I’m approx 83% IDC on 1700’s at 640whp dynojet at 8600rpm

    However my 450 is maxed as it starts to lean out 7,800rpm plus

    Oem fuel rail, feed and return lines
    Good to know. You got that in a surge tank though don't you? I just have it in tank with the OEM wiring still.

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