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Thread: "Loose" at higher speeds?

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    "Loose" at higher speeds?

    I had an alignment done a few months back but haven't been driving much due to various other issues.. after the alignment, things felt a little squirrely/loose while driving at any speeds, but I chalked it up to grip tires and more firm suspension so inputs were much more pronounced.

    Today however I was driving on the highway and noticed the steering felt REALLY loose. To the point where it felt as if I would go careening off the road if I were to even sneeze. I've never had that feeling before, and it sure as hell wasn't like this before the alignment (same suspension).

    Any ideas on things to take a peek at? I can dig up the alignment sheet but it was all within the Mitsu specs.. Driving me crazy (no pun intended..)

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    Post up the alignment sheet but in the mean time just double check tyre pressures also & maybe cast your eye over the suspension arms, bushes etc to see if any obvious wear etc.

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    Evo X Harlot UT_EvoX's Avatar
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    The only things are if something was left loose and sometimes 0 rear toe screws causes "tram-lining."
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    Just realized the dang guy didn't give me the "final" report, but this was 2nd to last report and very minimal change from these (I believe he brought the camber to about -1.6 and -1.5 with no real changes anywhere else?)

    I'll have to give a glance to see if anything is loose tomorrow. Alignments something I've always been terrible understanding, but these numbers all seem to be within their printed specs so I didn't question it much..

    Left front:
    Camber; -1.4
    Caster; 4.1
    Toe 0.01

    Right front:
    Camber; -1.5
    Caster; 4.3
    Toe; 0.00

    Left Rear:
    Camber; -1.7
    Toe; 0.14

    Right Rear:
    Camber; -1.7
    Toe; 0.15

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    Evo X Harlot UT_EvoX's Avatar
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    Is the rear toe-in or toe-out? Should be toe-in
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    Can't tell, attached images..
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Junior Member sikevo's Avatar
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    I had the exact same feeling in my car once and I found the rear control arm bolts were loose.

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    whats with almost -2 degrees camber in the rear? Your running more camber in rear then front which is odd. You normally want it the other way around.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zabes View Post
    whats with almost -2 degrees camber in the rear? Your running more camber in rear then front which is odd. You normally want it the other way around.
    Yeah, unfortunately I don't have the "final" #s but the rear camber was reduced (brought more positive), but not much - only to about -1.5 or -1.6. This is with Tein Flex Z Coilovers, lowered to the their suggested height (so nothing insane, and higher than Eibach springs).

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    Senior Member razorlab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saytheb View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zabes View Post
    whats with almost -2 degrees camber in the rear? Your running more camber in rear then front which is odd. You normally want it the other way around.
    Yeah, unfortunately I don't have the "final" #s but the rear camber was reduced (brought more positive), but not much - only to about -1.5 or -1.6. This is with Tein Flex Z Coilovers, lowered to the their suggested height (so nothing insane, and higher than Eibach springs).
    Personally I would add more negative camber in front. Evos really wake up after -2 as they are heavy. I run -3.2 in front but it's mainly for track.

    -2 camber will be just fine on tires as long as your toe is good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by razorlab View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by saytheb View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zabes View Post
    whats with almost -2 degrees camber in the rear? Your running more camber in rear then front which is odd. You normally want it the other way around.
    Yeah, unfortunately I don't have the "final" #s but the rear camber was reduced (brought more positive), but not much - only to about -1.5 or -1.6. This is with Tein Flex Z Coilovers, lowered to the their suggested height (so nothing insane, and higher than Eibach springs).
    Personally I would add more negative camber in front. Evos really wake up after -2 as they are heavy. I run -3.2 in front but it's mainly for track.

    -2 camber will be just fine on tires as long as your toe is good.
    I'm probably going to head in for another alignment at a different shop. If they can't reduce the rear camber, I think I'll see if they can increase the front. I'm also going to have them revisit the toe in the rear as it seems pretty high.

    I also just realized why my entire plastic trunk cover was loose at the top. Pretty sure the previous guys pulled the cover on the top and never replaced the pop rivets. Thanks.....

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    Senior Member pistolpete69916's Avatar
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    So you have.. toe-out? Wut. It should be negative on the chart, or toe-in, or zero toe. You have toe-out lol

    Also, get your rear camber either: same as front, or less than front. I really liked -1.5 all around and 0.00 toe across the board, never had "loose" issues. Sometimes with certain tires (Conti DW) on GROOVED pavement roads, the car can squirm left and right even with a death grip on the wheel in a straight line. So thats when toe-in would alleviate that. My solution: buy tires that aren't retarded.

    Agree more front camber than rear is better, but if it's purely a street car.. then...

    0.15 or -0.15 is WAY too much toe either way. Like ideally you'd want that to be -0.08 or less (if you wanted to run any toe in the first place). Just tell them to zero it out.
    Last edited by pistolpete69916; 01-24-2018 at 09:08 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pistolpete69916 View Post
    So you have.. toe-out? Wut. It should be negative on the chart, or toe-in, or zero toe. You have toe-out lol

    Also, get your rear camber either: same as front, or less than front. I really liked -1.5 all around and 0.00 toe across the board, never had "loose" issues. Sometimes with certain tires (Conti DW) on GROOVED pavement roads, the car can squirm left and right even with a death grip on the wheel in a straight line. So thats when toe-in would alleviate that. My solution: buy tires that aren't retarded.

    Agree more front camber than rear is better, but if it's purely a street car.. then...

    0.15 or -0.15 is WAY too much toe either way. Like ideally you'd want that to be -0.08 or less (if you wanted to run any toe in the first place). Just tell them to zero it out.
    Definitely not the tires - I've had them longer than the suspension and never felt this before. It's nothing like the yanking down I25 near Dacono where it's grooved as hell. 80+ and it starts to feel almost like I have no downforce at all (wing and lip are still on) - the whole chassis feels like it doesn't want to stay planted anymore.

    I'm gonna either see if I can get into SCR the next couple days, or if I can reach Hsun - wherever he may suggest. I'm almost positive the alignments foobar'd..

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    Evo X Harlot UT_EvoX's Avatar
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    That looks like toe-in which shouldn't be causing the car to wander at highway speeds.

    My vote is something is loose.
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    Yeah, i've driven a few laps on a racetrack with a loose rear LCA before and that was pretty wild!!!

    I've had an alignment tech not tighten the bolts properly and it all came loose after a few laps.

    Additionally, i found that the rubber bushings on the evo, when they go bad, tend to be a little catastrophic. My front LCA bushing was the first to go and it created really weird behavior, but it really made the handling bad. Recently the bushings in the rear went out and i get instantaneous snap oversteer if i corner anywhere around the limit.
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